Picking this week’s Stupid Thing of the Week was easy. It’s not too often — as in, “never, before now” — that someone other than a drunken gun freak promotes the concept of drinking while carrying a firearm. Be forewarned, though, that people in our neighbor state, Virginia, are considering the possibility. The leader of the Virginia Citizens Defense League gun lobby, Philip Van Cleve (personal motto: “Abstract principles trump common sense”) wants the state’s legislature to defend the “right” to drink alcohol while carrying a gun in public.
The VCDL is dissatisfied with a new state law that allows “concealed carry permit holders to bring loaded handguns” into establishments that serve alcohol, “as long as the holders do not consume alcohol.” The group says the law — which allows law enforcement officers and state attorneys to carry concealed weapons and slam down liquor — turns regular, good ol’ bar-hopping gun carriers into second-class citizens. VCDL leader Van Cleve says his group thinks the law should read that gun carriers can drink, “as long they are not drunk.” Two obvious questions remain, however: Who the hell wants the job of refusing to serve a semi-drunk with a loaded gun? Or, for that matter, taking away a drunk’s gun? As one would expect, the state’s police chiefs are strongly opposed to Van Cleve’s brainstorm. In normal times, one could automatically assume such potentially catastrophic B.S. wouldn’t stand a chance of passing, but considering the weird, overwrought state of Conservative Nation these days, we thought readers would appreciate being warned ahead of time, just in case Virginia decides to go all Arizona Crazy on us.
This article appears in Apr 27 – May 3, 2010.
Philip Van Cleave has also stated before that an acceptable solution would be to forbid EVERYBODY from drinking while carrying. Ask him yourself. He’s not actively lobbying to get VA citizens the right to drink while carrying. He’s actively lobbying for the same standard to be applied equally. Commonwealth’s Attorneys and Police Officers are not magically empowered to consume alcohol without their judgement being impaired. It is MY belief that Philip Van Cleave is arguing from the side you stated in order to emphasize that.
For the record, I am a member of the Virginia Citizens Defense League, but I am not an authorized spokesperson for the VCDL or Mr. Van Cleave.
What a moroon. This liberal is squaking over the possiblity that people with concealed carry guns might drink. What a fool. I guess it was too hard for him to grasp that folks have been OPEN CARRYING and drinking in VA for years with no problems.
I guess he never heard of bad guys going into bars or restaraunts and killing unarmed folks.
Why do liberal hoplophobes always fret over things that have never happened ans ignore thigns that have. Such a disconnect with reality!!
Abstract principles trump common sense? Each and every time, if by abstract principles you are referring to those set forth by the founding fathers in the Constitution. You see, America is not a Democracy, where common sense goes where the wind blows them, or where the government tells you it should. This is a Republic. If the wish of a majority goes against the founding principles, it just does not apply. My rights, the real ones (Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness, along with those safeguarded from Government action by the Bill of Rights), are not subject to approval, discussion or re-evaluation.
And all VCDL is trying to achieve is to eliminate preferential treatment for people working on our dollar (or not), elite classes whose privileges are greater than our own rights. Just to follow the spirit of that other pesky document full of Abstract Principles we call the Declaration of Independence, and all the talk about that all men are created equal. I like to quote, for effect, a little section of it: “That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.”
Looks like you found the true “Stupid Thing of the Week” and did it yourself!
I am speaking for myself.
I don’t EVER consume liquor in any form and touch guns. Not when I’m hunting, at the range, in uniform or carrying concealed.I won’t even clean a gun after drinking alcohol.
Did you purposely only tell half the story so you could rant about guns and alcohol? Not mentioning that VCDL had a matching bill that would prohibit drinking for anyone carrying concealed seems like you simply had an agenda. As others have said above, VCDL was just asking the General Assembly to pick one solution or the other and be consistent in applying it to everybody.
I do realize this takes the wind out of your sales, but you should research before you start writing.
Great article by John Grooms and he’s absolutely right. His facts are always substantiated and infuriates the small minded, which is most of redneck Charlotte.
Oh my Lord, is that another picture of SARA PALIN’S DAUGHTER?!!!
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John… I respect your views about drinking and carrying loaded weapons. I can see where you feel this is dangerous mix. Just wish you wouldn’t hurt my feelings so much with the name calling, such as stupid and freak… I’m sensitive. Well, okay, I am a freak.. and the chick in the pic is totally HOT, but I digress.
How about we make a deal, you stay in MD where it is safe, and leave VA to us Virginians? I find that the only thing of interest in MD are your crabs (which we take from MD with our guns anyway) and women – who like to come to VA to attend our impressive gun shows, shoot our pistols, and attend VA Tea Parties with us. It’s all good.
Waaaaaahhhhhhhhhh. Guns are bad. Waaaaaahhhhhhhhhh. Guns are scary.
Waahhhhhhhhhhh. I’m going to throw a temper tantrum. Waaaahhhhhhh. I hate the constitution. Waaaaahhhhhh. I can’t read very well. Waaaaaahhhhhhhh. I think the police and commonwealths attorneys are special and deserve special privileges. Waaaaahhhhhhh. Waaaahhhhhhh. Waaaahhhhhh.
Excuse me, but I’m afraid that you haven’t been paying attention.
I’m not a member of VCDL, but I do own a handgun and I have a Concealed Handgun Permit. I also know the law, which seems to be more than you do.
In Virginia, it has always been the law that most adults are allowed to openly carry a sidearm, and are also allowed to have a beer. It’s a crime to be intoxicated in public, and a separate crime to be carrying a weapon while drunk.
To carry a weapon discreetly (concealed), most people need a permit. If they have a permit, and are carrying concealed, they are not allowed to even enter a place that serves alcohol.
Those laws have an exemption for “special people”. Any Commonwealth’s Attorney or Assistant C.A., and any on-duty police officer of any description, and most RETIRED law-enforcement officers, are permitted to carry a concealed weapon into a tavern and drink.
Those are the current laws, whether they’re logical or not. The new law coming into effect on July first will allow people with CHPs to enter a place that serves alcohol while carrying concealed, so long as they do not drink.
Van Cleave’s comment, as I understand it, is that ordinary citizens with CHPs should be treated the same as the thousands of “special people” are, in that they can simultaneously have their weapon concealed and still have a glass of wine with their meal, or a cold beer on a hot day.
No one is advocating getting drunk while carrying a weapon.
As for the questions you pose, the same people who now deal with cops and CAs and ACAs and retired cops would now deal with ordinary citizens who have CHPs. There would be about the same level of problems, or lack thereof, as there are now. I’d have thought that would have been obvious, but then again I would have thought that you’d take the time to learn what the law is before you wrote a column about changing it.
You, Mr. Grooms, are a jackass. Try a little fact finding before publishing such a blatantly, ignorant piece.